Water and Wastewater.com Help Forums - Need some answers regarding MBBR please!

ryn079

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Need some answers regarding MBBR please!
Nov 26^th, 2010, 7:07am

Hi guys,
I have been reading a paper by Hallvard Odegaard regarding MBBR. He states that the fill volume with media of the reaction tank is 67%, and this results in a total carrier specific are of 435m2/m3 for the K1, which equates to 335m2/m3 of effective specific surface are since the biomass is growing on the inside.
Can you please explain how he got these figures as from the AnoxKaldness website, the K1 has a total surface of 800m2/m3 and a protected surface of 500m2/m3.
The title of the paper is “Advanced compact Wastewater Treatment based on coagulation and moving bed biofilm processes”.
Any help would be much appreciated.
Thanks in advance.

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Liang YaBB Newbies Offline I love Water and Wastewater.com Posts: 47 Sydney Gender: Company or Organization: Ovivo	Re: Need some answers regarding MBBR please! Reply #1 - Dec 2^nd, 2010, 9:38pm If they are talking about the same carrier, then one of them would be wrong.
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ryn079 Junior Member Offline I love Water and Wastewater.com Posts: 99 Gender: Company or Organization: Wastewater treatment	Re: Need some answers regarding MBBR please! Reply #2 - Dec 3^rd, 2010, 2:53am Yes, the paper was refering to the same carrier. Thanks for replying but i managed to understand how the filling fraction affects the available surface area.
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JAllen

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Re: Need some answers regarding MBBR please!
Reply #3 - Dec 3^rd, 2010, 12:13pm

In the first case, the m3 are based on the total tank volume. In the second case they are based on the media volume.

500 x 0.67 = 335

In his paper he must have used 650 for the total number instead of 800

650 x 0.67 = 435.

Regardless, 500 m2/m3 is the magic number.

500 x %fill x tank liquid volume = X m2 of effective surface area.

Jeff Allen
Brown and Caldwell

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Monroe YaBB Newbies Offline I love Water and Wastewater.com Posts: 9 Gender: Company or Organization: Marcel Sembat high school	Re: Need some answers regarding MBBR please! Reply #4 - Dec 3^rd, 2010, 4:40pm Question: Do somebody know how many pieces. of K1 are contained in 1 m³?
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ryn079 Junior Member Offline I love Water and Wastewater.com Posts: 99 Gender: Company or Organization: Wastewater treatment	Re: Need some answers regarding MBBR please! Reply #5 - Dec 4^th, 2010, 2:23am Thanks Jeff, for offering your help.
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australianwater Senior Member Offline Anything in Water : Packaged Wastewater Treatment Posts: 268 Australia Gender: Company or Organization: Wockoliver Limited	Re: Need some answers regarding MBBR please! Reply #6 - Dec 9^th, 2010, 10:24pm its an easy calculation buddy you have the volume of one K1 . hence total volume of 1 cum you can easily arrived at ? its simple division and you will arrive at number of pieces.
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Monroe

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Re: Need some answers regarding MBBR please!
Reply #7 - Dec 9^th, 2010, 11:18pm

australianwater wrote on Dec 9^th, 2010, 10:24pm:

its an easy calculation buddy you have the volume of one K1 . hence total volume of 1 cum you can easily arrived at ? its simple division and you will arrive at number of pieces.

No, it's not so simple.
First, I don't know the volume of one piece K1.
Second, the pieces are round shape.
Third, the pieces are lying in a random array.

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Tom Keenan - nesa

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Re: Need some answers regarding MBBR please!
Reply #8 - Dec 10^th, 2010, 5:37am

Hi Monroe,
I see that Kaldness have a representative in France and is listed as:
Alexandre Orlando
9, Place de l`Europe
B.P. 370
92851 Rueil-Malmaison Cedex
FRANCE
Ph: +33 1 47 16 38 96
Fx: +33 1 47 16 39 93
Email: Alexandre Orlando.

Maybe you should make contact with Kladness directly for the information that you require.

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australianwater

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Re: Need some answers regarding MBBR please!
Reply #9 - Dec 23^rd, 2010, 9:40am

Hi Monroe,

Buddy Wockoliver Inc. produces VOK Bio-Media which is an advanced version of K1 and K3 types of biomedia.
Based on my knowledge of that I had suggested.
Following is the right way to go about it if you want to do it EXACTLY.

First and more accurate method ( although not required )

take a vernier and measure accurately all the length and dia of a single piece ,

With these dimensions you can calculate the volume of this ONE piece and now if you divide 1 CUM with this , you have total number of Pieces.

SECOND METHOD ( good for all practical purposes )

Take a small box of known volume , stuff as much as pieces as you can in this,
Now you know in this volume say X nos of pieces and you can calculate how much such boxes will be required for 1 CUM

Although there are two basic type of biomedia being manufactured across the globe ,
The smaller pieces ( every company name it differently we call it VOK 1 and VOK 3 types ) require 90,000 pieces for 1 cum

and the bigger version /type of this requires 65 to 70 K .

If you have any question including for surface area or how to relate surface to volume or to biofilm /BOD or any other, you are most welcome to e mail me at wockoliver@gmail.com

Thanks and Regards

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australianwater Senior Member Offline Anything in Water : Packaged Wastewater Treatment Posts: 268 Australia Gender: Company or Organization: Wockoliver Limited	Re: Need some answers regarding MBBR please! Reply #10 - Dec 23^rd, 2010, 9:41am Dear Monroe, One more important factor I missed about Biomedia is that its NOT important how many pieces makes one cum but more important is that how much total surface area it provides and what fraction of that is protected surface area. Regards
Back to top	Australian Water Technical Advisor Wockoliver Limited www.wockoliver.com http://wockoliver.tradeindia.com/ A Total Water Management Company Deals In : DAF Clarifier, Membrane Bioreactors,VOK Biomedia, MBBR Biomedia, Packaged sewage treatment Plants MBBR, MBBR-MBR , Ultrafiltration, Nanofilration , Industrial wastewater recycling, Z IP Logged

australianwater Senior Member Offline Anything in Water : Packaged Wastewater Treatment Posts: 268 Australia Gender: Company or Organization: Wockoliver Limited	Re: Need some answers regarding MBBR please! Reply #11 - Dec 23^rd, 2010, 9:42am Dear Monroe, One more important factor I missed about Biomedia is that its NOT important how many pieces makes one cum but more important is that how much total surface area it provides and what fraction of that is protected surface area. Regards
Back to top	Australian Water Technical Advisor Wockoliver Limited www.wockoliver.com http://wockoliver.tradeindia.com/ A Total Water Management Company Deals In : DAF Clarifier, Membrane Bioreactors,VOK Biomedia, MBBR Biomedia, Packaged sewage treatment Plants MBBR, MBBR-MBR , Ultrafiltration, Nanofilration , Industrial wastewater recycling, Z IP Logged